| Author |
Message |
|
bbarry
|
 Posted: Sat Jun 20, 2020 8:38 am |
|
 |
| welcoming committee |
 |
Joined: Fri Nov 30, 2012 12:47 am
Posts: 2432
Location: North Central Arkansas
|
|
I have a 15 year old Win 7 computer that I want to get rid of. The local recycle center does accept computer hardware....CPUs, monitors, printers, etc. regardless of working order. I don't know what they do with this hardware, although I suspect that they pass the hardware on to a 3rd party recycler.
Before I take my old computer to this recycle center, I want to make sure that the C drive is wiped completely clean of all personal data. What is the best way to do this? Would a clean (re)install of Win 7 do the trick if I opted to not keep programs and data? Or is there a better way?
I really don't want to mess with removing the hard and taking a hammer to it, but I guess that is one possibility. Thanks in advance......
|
|
  |
|
 |
|
sboots
|
Posted: Sat Jun 20, 2020 10:55 am |
|
|
| Site Admin |
 |
Joined: Tue Apr 10, 2012 9:48 pm
Posts: 2959
Location: New Jersey
|
|
| |
|
|
|
bbarry
|
Posted: Sat Jun 20, 2020 11:29 am |
|
|
| welcoming committee |
|
Joined: Fri Nov 30, 2012 12:47 am
Posts: 2432
Location: North Central Arkansas
|
|
Thanks, Steve. I read about DBAN. It looks like when I download the program I get an ISO file that I can then burn to disk. I would then boot from this disk and start the erasing process. Is that your understanding of how it all works?
|
|
| |
|
|
|
Doddie
|
Posted: Sat Jun 20, 2020 4:40 pm |
|
|
| welcoming committee |
 |
Joined: Sun Jan 13, 2013 4:13 pm
Posts: 1741
Location: Dunedin, Alba.
|
|
The easy option might be to encrypt the drive then format it with third party software, that should render any info on the drive useless if someone tries to restore the data on the drive.
If you really want to be belt and braces, encrypt/format then take the drive apart and throw any memory chips and/or the disc platter on the BBQ when you've finished eating what you've BBQ'd.
(probably not recommended if you want to be environmentally friendly).
Go deep sea fishing and throw the drive overboard, again not entirely environmentally friendly but probably the safest if you never want your drive to be accessed again.
I personally wouldn't trust a recycling centre until i'd removed or destroyed whatever was holding the data, e.g, memory chips on an SSD or the platter in a HDD.
YMMV.
|
|
| |
|
|
|
sboots
|
Posted: Sat Jun 20, 2020 6:43 pm |
|
|
| Site Admin |
|
Joined: Tue Apr 10, 2012 9:48 pm
Posts: 2959
Location: New Jersey
|
bbarry wrote: Thanks, Steve. I read about DBAN. It looks like when I download the program I get an ISO file that I can then burn to disk. I would then boot from this disk and start the erasing process. Is that your understanding of how it all works? Yes, that's exactly correct. I put it on a bootable USB thumb drive to wipe a few computers that I donated. -steve _________________ stephen boots Microsoft MVP 2004 - 2020 "Life's always an adventure with computers!"
|
|
| |
|
|
|
bbarry
|
Posted: Sat Jun 20, 2020 7:58 pm |
|
|
| welcoming committee |
|
Joined: Fri Nov 30, 2012 12:47 am
Posts: 2432
Location: North Central Arkansas
|
|
Steve, thanks for the confirmation.
Doddie, thanks for your suggestion, but I much prefer recycling to pollution.
|
|
| |
|
|
|
jaylach
|
Posted: Sat Jun 20, 2020 8:02 pm |
|
|
| Resident Geekazoid Administrator |
 |
Joined: Wed Mar 21, 2012 5:09 am
Posts: 9485
Location: The state of confusion; I just use Wyoming for mail.
|
|
If you have Acronis I THINK that the recovery media also has a wipe option but am not positive and can't re-boot right now to check as I'm in the middle of a video conversion.
|
|
| |
|
|
|
bbarry
|
Posted: Sun Jun 21, 2020 9:02 pm |
|
|
| welcoming committee |
|
Joined: Fri Nov 30, 2012 12:47 am
Posts: 2432
Location: North Central Arkansas
|
|
Steve, I have DBAN up and running, but it certainly is slow. The hard drive on that old computer is 500 GB; after 6.5 hours, I am only 28% completed using the 'autonuke' option. I'll need to shave again before it finishes.
Was your experience also this slow? I guess that's what happens when the program has to 'touch' all the 0's and 1's.
|
|
| |
|
|
|
sboots
|
Posted: Sun Jun 21, 2020 9:52 pm |
|
|
| Site Admin |
|
Joined: Tue Apr 10, 2012 9:48 pm
Posts: 2959
Location: New Jersey
|
|
Yes, it is very slow. I had it running for more than 24 hours on on laptop... It's doing a whole lot of writes to wipe the drive clean and unreadable.
_________________ stephen boots Microsoft MVP 2004 - 2020 "Life's always an adventure with computers!"
|
|
| |
|
|
|
jaylach
|
Posted: Sun Jun 21, 2020 10:03 pm |
|
|
| Resident Geekazoid Administrator |
|
Joined: Wed Mar 21, 2012 5:09 am
Posts: 9485
Location: The state of confusion; I just use Wyoming for mail.
|
bbarry wrote: Steve, I have DBAN up and running, but it certainly is slow. The hard drive on that old computer is 500 GB; after 6.5 hours, I am only 28% completed using the 'autonuke' option. I'll need to shave again before it finishes.
Was your experience also this slow? I guess that's what happens when the program has to 'touch' all the 0's and 1's. From what I understand all such programs take a very long time. The thing is that they have to overwrite every sector on the drive several times before data cannot still be found. Think about it... If totally wiping a drive were to be simple a simple format of the drive would do. This just isn't the case. Format a drive and it is good to go as to accepting new data but the old data is still there and can be found in what I like to call shadows. There is software that can read these shadows. A total wipe involves writing random 1 & 0 over the entire drive until the 'shadows can no longer be seen. On a 500 GB drive I would not be at all surprised if the wipe process took a day and a half.
|
|
| |
|
|
|
jaylach
|
Posted: Sun Jun 21, 2020 10:41 pm |
|
|
| Resident Geekazoid Administrator |
|
Joined: Wed Mar 21, 2012 5:09 am
Posts: 9485
Location: The state of confusion; I just use Wyoming for mail.
|
sboots wrote: Yes, it is very slow. I had it running for more than 24 hours on on laptop... It's doing a whole lot of writes to wipe the drive clean and unreadable. Hey Steve, do you remember the old days when you could do a 'raw' or 'basic' format on a drive? Probably did close to the same as a wipe but I just don't see the option any more. Is it still there or gone? I suspect that one would have to back to DOS and fdisk to still do this......
|
|
| |
|
|
|
bbarry
|
Posted: Mon Jun 22, 2020 8:04 am |
|
|
| welcoming committee |
|
Joined: Fri Nov 30, 2012 12:47 am
Posts: 2432
Location: North Central Arkansas
|
|
Steve, just curious. If you were going to donate your computer after you cleaned it with DBAN, did you reinstall just the operating system?
|
|
| |
|
|
|
sboots
|
Posted: Mon Jun 22, 2020 12:48 pm |
|
|
| Site Admin |
|
Joined: Tue Apr 10, 2012 9:48 pm
Posts: 2959
Location: New Jersey
|
jaylach wrote: Hey Steve, do you remember the old days when you could do a 'raw' or 'basic' format on a drive? Probably did close to the same as a wipe but I just don't see the option any more. Is it still there or gone? I suspect that one would have to back to DOS and fdisk to still do this...... I do indeed remember that, but that wasn't a wipe, either, to the best of my knowledge. With the right tools, data was still recoverable. _________________ stephen boots Microsoft MVP 2004 - 2020 "Life's always an adventure with computers!"
|
|
| |
|
|
|
sboots
|
Posted: Mon Jun 22, 2020 12:51 pm |
|
|
| Site Admin |
|
Joined: Tue Apr 10, 2012 9:48 pm
Posts: 2959
Location: New Jersey
|
bbarry wrote: Steve, just curious. If you were going to donate your computer after you cleaned it with DBAN, did you reinstall just the operating system? I installed the OS on a Lenovo laptop that had decent specs and able to run Windows 10 well. On a few other older laptops I simply let them blank. -steve _________________ stephen boots Microsoft MVP 2004 - 2020 "Life's always an adventure with computers!"
|
|
| |
|
|
|
bbarry
|
Posted: Mon Jun 22, 2020 1:11 pm |
|
|
| welcoming committee |
|
Joined: Fri Nov 30, 2012 12:47 am
Posts: 2432
Location: North Central Arkansas
|
sboots wrote: bbarry wrote: Steve, just curious. If you were going to donate your computer after you cleaned it with DBAN, did you reinstall just the operating system? I installed the OS on a Lenovo laptop that had decent specs and able to run Windows 10 well. On a few other older laptops I simply let them blank. -steve Good to know. This computer is ~15 years old and incapable of running Win 10. So I will just leave it blank and give it to recycle.
|
|
| |
|
|
|
Doddie
|
Posted: Mon Jun 22, 2020 4:01 pm |
|
|
| welcoming committee |
|
Joined: Sun Jan 13, 2013 4:13 pm
Posts: 1741
Location: Dunedin, Alba.
|
bbarry wrote: Steve, thanks for the confirmation.
Doddie, thanks for your suggestion, but I much prefer recycling to pollution. I'm with you on that, but it is probably the safest option.
|
|
| |
|
|
|
jaylach
|
Posted: Mon Jun 22, 2020 4:30 pm |
|
|
| Resident Geekazoid Administrator |
|
Joined: Wed Mar 21, 2012 5:09 am
Posts: 9485
Location: The state of confusion; I just use Wyoming for mail.
|
Doddie wrote: bbarry wrote: Steve, thanks for the confirmation.
Doddie, thanks for your suggestion, but I much prefer recycling to pollution. I'm with you on that, but it is probably the safest option. One could always remove the drive and drill a bunch of holes through the whole thing then put the drive back in. Drive destroyed and the recycle is still stuck with dealing with it.
|
|
| |
|
|
|
Doddie
|
Posted: Mon Jun 22, 2020 4:31 pm |
|
|
| welcoming committee |
|
Joined: Sun Jan 13, 2013 4:13 pm
Posts: 1741
Location: Dunedin, Alba.
|
jaylach wrote: Format a drive and it is good to go as to accepting new data but the old data is still there and can be found in what I like to call shadows. There is software that can read these shadows. A total wipe involves writing random 1 & 0 over the entire drive until the 'shadows can no longer be seen.
On a 500 GB drive I would not be at all surprised if the wipe process took a day and a half. My understanding of Windows, at least up to Windows 7, is that when a file is deleted the only thing that happens is the first charachter of a filename is renamed with something akin to $, and that's also as far as as Windows format goes. Even over-writing sectors with 1's & 0's probably means nothing with today's computer fosensic science.
Last edited by Doddie on Mon Jun 22, 2020 4:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.
|
|
| |
|
|
|
Doddie
|
Posted: Mon Jun 22, 2020 4:34 pm |
|
|
| welcoming committee |
|
Joined: Sun Jan 13, 2013 4:13 pm
Posts: 1741
Location: Dunedin, Alba.
|
jaylach wrote: One could always remove the drive and drill a bunch of holes through the whole thing then put the drive back in. Drive destroyed and the recycle is still stuck with dealing with it. That might work if booting from a drive is a priority but it's well documented that the security services have the technology to reclaim data from partially destroyed drives. Drilling a hole in a drive will only render that part of the drive that's been drilled as unrecoverable. If the security services can do it, you can bet miscreants can do it too.
|
|
| |
|
|
|
bbarry
|
Posted: Mon Jun 22, 2020 8:13 pm |
|
|
| welcoming committee |
|
Joined: Fri Nov 30, 2012 12:47 am
Posts: 2432
Location: North Central Arkansas
|
Well, the 500 GB hard drive erasing job is done.....it took just under 24 hours to complete the job. It probably would have taken a little less time except for the fact that I restarted DBAM a few times, always thinking that something was wrong because the process was so slow. So tomorrow its off to the recycle center. If anyone there is smart enough to break the 0/1 code, so be it. They will be disappointed in the actual data contained thereon. 
|
|
| |
|
|
|
bbarry
|
Posted: Mon Jun 22, 2020 8:22 pm |
|
|
| welcoming committee |
|
Joined: Fri Nov 30, 2012 12:47 am
Posts: 2432
Location: North Central Arkansas
|
Doddie wrote: My understanding of Windows, at least up to Windows 7, is that when a file is deleted the only thing that happens is the first charachter of a filename is renamed with something akin to $, and that's also as far as as Windows format goes.
Even over-writing sectors with 1's & 0's probably means nothing with today's computer fosensic science. Doddie, I remember in the (very) olden days when the forte of Norton Utilities was to find that missing character and recover the file. I used the utility many times when I screwed up and accidentally deleted a file.
|
|
| |
|
|
|
jaylach
|
Posted: Mon Jun 22, 2020 8:28 pm |
|
|
| Resident Geekazoid Administrator |
|
Joined: Wed Mar 21, 2012 5:09 am
Posts: 9485
Location: The state of confusion; I just use Wyoming for mail.
|
bbarry wrote: Well, the 500 GB hard drive erasing job is done.....it took just under 24 hours to complete the job. It probably would have taken a little less time except for the fact that I restarted DBAM a few times, always thinking that something was wrong because the process was so slow. So tomorrow its off to the recycle center. If anyone there is smart enough to break the 0/1 code, so be it. They will be disappointed in the actual data contained thereon. Ya know... there is part of me that does not even worry about this aspect. I mean what is someone going to get?, my pictures?? They may get a link to my bank but could still not log in. Personally I think that some of the drive concern is overblown.
|
|
| |
|
|
|
bbarry
|
Posted: Mon Jun 22, 2020 9:20 pm |
|
|
| welcoming committee |
|
Joined: Fri Nov 30, 2012 12:47 am
Posts: 2432
Location: North Central Arkansas
|
|
Personally, I'm not concerned about the data on your hard drive either, lol.
But I kept a lot of financial and personal data on my computer, and I did not want to take the chance. And I am a little surprised to see you take such a cavalier attitude toward computer security....doesn't sound like something you would say or do.
|
|
| |
|
|
|
sboots
|
Posted: Mon Jun 22, 2020 9:37 pm |
|
|
| Site Admin |
|
Joined: Tue Apr 10, 2012 9:48 pm
Posts: 2959
Location: New Jersey
|
|
I think Jay does take it seriously, but wonders if maybe we can sometimes be too cautious and concerned. In my case, I make sure the drives are properly cleaned if the PC will be donated or recycled -- for the same reason as you, BB. I keep a fair amount of financial data on my PC and don't really want that in the wrong hands. Yes, the risk is very, very low, but it is still there. The effort to wipe the drive securely is worthwhile for my peace of mind.
-steve
_________________ stephen boots Microsoft MVP 2004 - 2020 "Life's always an adventure with computers!"
|
|
| |
|
|
|
jaylach
|
Posted: Mon Jun 22, 2020 9:43 pm |
|
|
| Resident Geekazoid Administrator |
|
Joined: Wed Mar 21, 2012 5:09 am
Posts: 9485
Location: The state of confusion; I just use Wyoming for mail.
|
bbarry wrote: Personally, I'm not concerned about the data on your hard drive either, lol.
But I kept a lot of financial and personal data on my computer, and I did not want to take the chance. And I am a little surprised to see you take such a cavalier attitude toward computer security....doesn't sound like something you would say or do. I can understand your point but you have to consider that my concern for security makes me keep any financial info on an external drive or separate internal drive. There is absolutely zero personal data kept on my system drive. In such a case that you are looking you are talking about the system drive. One should NEVER keep personal data on their system drive... Just my opinion. 
|
|
| |
|
|
|
