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 Post Posted: Fri Dec 08, 2017 5:40 pm 
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Not entirely sure where i should post this, i figure i should start here and a moderator can downgrade if required ;)

It relates to Microsoft Security Essentials (MSE) on my Windows 7 x64 pc, i have no idea if other OS's or other MS anti-virus/malware products also display the same characteristics.

That out the way, after reading the following article and not having Windows set to automatically check for updates i thought it a good idea to run a manual scan for this "out-of-band security update":
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2017/12/07 ... rotection/

cf. https://portal.msrc.microsoft.com/en-US ... 2017-11937

To my surprise the only update i was presented with was a definition update for MSE... on checking the MSE settings/help/about (it's not actually on the help button, select the down arrow to the side) apparently my "Engine Version" had already been updated to a version post the 'fix' being released.
Quote:
For affected software, verify that the Microsoft Malware Protection Engine version is 1.1.14405.2 or later.


As fate would have it i had to initiate a System Restore tonight after trying to look for updated AMD Chipset Drivers for my Gigabyte motherboard... not much of a story there other than the AMD software reported i already had the latest drivers installed but i couldn't an uninstall option anywhere so reached for System Restore to remove their software...

After i restored (my choice limited by the phantom Windows Update issue many suffered earlier this week because i deleted my Software Distribution folder that contains the history of all updates as part of the process i used to get WU working again) i thought it would be a good opportunity to roll back to the earliest point i could, 07/12/2017 20:52:12.
That was last night and i know i didn't manually install anything because i spent most of yesterday in hospital having a tooth removed under general anaesthetic and i only booted my pc to check emails and see what was happening in a few Forums.

Anyway, after restoring i immediately checked my MSE engine version number and it was 1.1.14306.0, a version susceptible to the attack MS are warning about... i ran Windows Update and the only option was an "Optional" Definition Update for MSE, i installed it, checked the MSE engine number again and it had been updated to 1.1.14405.2

The only conclusion can be that not only are MS releasing definition updates for MSE as "optional", i knew and know they've always installed automatically, but it now appears that Critical Updates are getting installed behind the scenes as well... it raises the question about when did they started automatically installing Critical Updates for MSE (*1)... and what else are they potentially installing that I've explicitly said "not yet, or no" to??

(1). System Restore listed yesterdays update as a Critical Update, and after i installed todays "optional update" that changed the MSE engine number it too was listed as a Critical Update in System Restore... in Windows Update/View Update History the only updates are MSE definition Update and they are ALL listed as optional.

Make of all that what you will, i don't necessarily view it as a bad thing if the danger to my PC is that real but even as a common courtesy i would expect MS to tell me that's what they plan to do... that they haven't and didn't, well, lets just say behaviour like this is not going to get me onto anything like Win10 any time soon.


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 Post Posted: Fri Dec 08, 2017 8:13 pm 
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I can't really give a definate answer but would assume that Security Essentials updates reside outside of normal Windows Updates. In Windows 7 Defender is anti malware and Security Essentials is anti virus. Since Defender is built into Windows 7 I would expect such version updates to fall under Windows Updates. However Security Essentials is not an installed Windows component but an additional download and install. Due to this I would expect it to reside outside of Windows Updates and to have its own update method.

In Windows 10 Defender is anti virus and I have Windows Updates set to notify only (not available in the Home version). Since Windows 10 Defender is a core component of Windows it falls under the Windows Updates venue and I even have to OK the download and install of definition updates. Security Essentials in Windows 7 is not a Windows core component hence resides outside of the Windows Updates venue just like any third party anti virus.

All the above is guesswork but probably not bad.

Question: Do you have Windows Updates set to only update Windows or to update Windows and other Microsoft products? The 'name' difference would be Windows Updates verses Microsoft Updates. If set to Microsoft Updates Security Essentials MAY then fall under the normal update venue but can't really say. Sorry that I'm not giving a definitive answer but doing about the best that I can. Years ago I used to use AVG or Avast for anti virus. Don't know how they do it today but back when I used it was the same thing. If I remember correctly AVG would do a version update and not even say that it did. Avast would automatically do the version update and just notify after that it had been done.

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 Post Posted: Fri Dec 08, 2017 11:33 pm 
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Microsoft Security Essentials has always updated itself -- engines and definitions -- no matter what your Windows Automatic Update settings are. Program updates -- that is, updates to the MSE user interface and functionality will usually, but not always, require interaction with you.

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 Post Posted: Sat Dec 09, 2017 5:07 pm 
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Thanks Jay & Steve, my main issue was why this issue is being flagged as critical yet there were no critical updates in WU, i wasn't entirely sure if MSE auto updated it's 'engines' or not... i knew it did with definitions but as this was a critical update i (wrongly) assumed it'd be listed in WU, of course it didn't help that System Restore lists the date the definition update was installed as a critical update yet WU history lists no critical updates installed.

Fwiw, i see that MS have updated the CVE article in my earlier post from version 1.0 to version 1.1 and "Added information to the Frequently Asked Questions."

I won't quote what's been added because i don't remember the exact wording of everything that was in version 1.0, suffice to say that if 1.0 had had the additional information i likely would never have started this thread! LOL

@Jay, to answer your specific question, Microsoft Update, i.e. "Give me updates for Microsoft products and check for new optional Microsoft software when i update Windows".


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 Post Posted: Sat Dec 09, 2017 6:15 pm 
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You are quite welcome Doddie. :) Glad that it is sorted to your satisfaction.

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 Post Posted: Sun Dec 10, 2017 10:33 am 
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sboots wrote:
Microsoft Security Essentials has always updated itself -- engines and definitions -- no matter what your Windows Automatic Update settings are....
-steve

And indeed that is the way it should be. All anti-Virus and anti-Malware programs should be allowed to update themselves automatically. Those are the ONLY two type programs I allow on my system to update automatically.
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