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Doddie
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Posted: Sat Dec 10, 2016 5:07 pm |
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welcoming committee |
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Joined: Sun Jan 13, 2013 4:13 pm Posts: 1723 Location: Dunedin, Alba.
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I don't normally post links directly from The Register but on this occasion I will (FYI, I consider The Register to be a tabloid newspaper on the internet, fun to read, often wrong, but every so often throws up little gems... who knows what it is on this occasion?), it appears on the surface of the article to be a DHCP issue that's primarily affecting UK BT (British Telecom) customer's computer connectivity for those running Win 8/10 after the latest compatibility update MS recently introduced. Whether the problem is related to a "third party update", "Microsoft updates", or indeed any other vendor's hardware or software update is as far as I can tell... anyone's guess at the moment Busted Windows 8, 10 update blamed for breaking Brits' DHCP:http://www.theregister.co.uk/2016/12/09 ... rking_bug/
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sboots
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Posted: Sun Dec 11, 2016 11:19 am |
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Site Admin |
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Joined: Tue Apr 10, 2012 9:48 pm Posts: 2946 Location: New Jersey
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jaylach
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Posted: Sun Dec 11, 2016 8:28 pm |
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Resident Geekazoid Administrator |
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Joined: Wed Mar 21, 2012 5:09 am Posts: 9438 Location: The state of confusion; I just use Wyoming for mail.
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While I never experienced any issues I guess that the unexpected update I got on the 10th is explained.
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sboots
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Posted: Sun Dec 11, 2016 8:36 pm |
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Site Admin |
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Joined: Tue Apr 10, 2012 9:48 pm Posts: 2946 Location: New Jersey
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jaylach wrote: While I never experienced any issues I guess that the unexpected update I got on the 10th is explained. Yep. It did affect me. My desktop ethernet connection lost connectivity to my router. Repair via Network and Sharing Center didn't resolve it, but a reboot did. -steve
_________________ stephen boots Microsoft MVP 2004 - 2020 "Life's always an adventure with computers!"
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jaylach
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Posted: Sun Dec 11, 2016 9:17 pm |
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Resident Geekazoid Administrator |
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Joined: Wed Mar 21, 2012 5:09 am Posts: 9438 Location: The state of confusion; I just use Wyoming for mail.
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LOL! My router is probably just too old to be affected. It is a D-Link DIR-601. https://www.cnet.com/products/d-link-di ... ter/specs/If not 8 years old it is close as I've had it for 7 years and bought it reconditioned and used for ~$20.00. Sometimes I consider replacing but the danged thing just keeps working without issue. Like I often say... Don't fix what isn't broken.
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sboots
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Posted: Sun Dec 11, 2016 11:00 pm |
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Site Admin |
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Joined: Tue Apr 10, 2012 9:48 pm Posts: 2946 Location: New Jersey
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Not the router, the network stack in Windows. It seems to only affect certain IP addresses or ranges. They haven't published any details, but the update is a temporary fix for those affected. Apparently they do know what the root cause is and it will be addressed more permanently in a subsequent update.
_________________ stephen boots Microsoft MVP 2004 - 2020 "Life's always an adventure with computers!"
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jaylach
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Posted: Sun Dec 11, 2016 11:21 pm |
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Resident Geekazoid Administrator |
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Joined: Wed Mar 21, 2012 5:09 am Posts: 9438 Location: The state of confusion; I just use Wyoming for mail.
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Hmmm, could the fact that I use Open DNS instead of the DNS provided by my ISP be a factor as to my not being affected? I doubt it as I'm sure that many that use their ISP provided DNS are also not affected.
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sboots
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Posted: Mon Dec 12, 2016 6:19 am |
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Site Admin |
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Joined: Tue Apr 10, 2012 9:48 pm Posts: 2946 Location: New Jersey
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The DNS symptom is simply due to the fact that the network adapter loses the IP address of the router and is assigned the defaults. Until the reboot there's no network connection. The PC can't "see" the router to get to OpenDNS. -steve
_________________ stephen boots Microsoft MVP 2004 - 2020 "Life's always an adventure with computers!"
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jaylach
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Posted: Mon Dec 12, 2016 8:54 am |
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Resident Geekazoid Administrator |
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Joined: Wed Mar 21, 2012 5:09 am Posts: 9438 Location: The state of confusion; I just use Wyoming for mail.
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OK, so I'm not unique. Still I don't seem to be able to get a grip on this type of issue. Not counting my 'Droid' tablets I'm running 2 instances of Win 10, 1 instance of Win 7 and 1 instance of XP. Why do I not have any issue? I don't do anything special with these systems. Security is strictly Windows default and MBAM except for the XP system which uses Avast and MBAM. Another question would be due to the fact that you say that the connection is lost until a re-boot. Most MS Updates require a re-boot... Why would the need of a re-boot be seen as not normal in this case? Sorry... I'm sure that I'm missing something but it seems, from what has been said, that the fix is just normal procedure in relation to Windows Updates. I mean, seriously, don't you all do a re-start of your system after installing updates even if there is not a request for such? This concept just sort of boggles my mind. I would never install updates to Windows without doing a re-start ASAP. I guess that is just me... I just don't see where this is an Update fault if a re-start fixes. In my opinion a re-start should be normal practice after ANY update. Sorry if I'm being dense...
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MacDuffie
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Posted: Mon Dec 12, 2016 10:09 am |
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Fearless Leader |
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Joined: Wed Mar 21, 2012 5:42 am Posts: 2819
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Now Jay, take it easy. Just because rebooting is normal procedure for you, does not mean it is normal procedure for everyone. Nor does it mean that those who do not reboot are dumb. It only means that they are not used to rebooting their machines in general. Microsoft itself has fostered this practice, especially with laptops where folks just close the lid and they're done at the end of the day. I have clients that actually don't know what a full shutdown is. Are they dumb folks? Not at all.
_________________ Patty MacDuffie Computer Haven Administrator
Live Long and Prosper Mr. Spock
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sboots
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Posted: Mon Dec 12, 2016 10:21 am |
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Site Admin |
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Joined: Tue Apr 10, 2012 9:48 pm Posts: 2946 Location: New Jersey
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Also, this issue did not crop up for everyone. In fact, only a small number of users. It only affected 1 of my PCs -- my desktop. It didn't affect my wife's desktop, another desktop with Win10, or any of the laptops and tablets in my house.
_________________ stephen boots Microsoft MVP 2004 - 2020 "Life's always an adventure with computers!"
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JoanA
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Posted: Mon Dec 12, 2016 1:45 pm |
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Moderator |
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Joined: Thu Apr 05, 2012 3:25 pm Posts: 1916 Location: Pembrokeshire, South Wales, UK
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As far as I know I've not had any issues with my computers losing connection, I had several updates on the 9th then another on the 10th, which was a cumulative one. This was on my Asus Notebook, not checked my desktops and hubby hasn't said anything about his, we all run 10.
All the machines here are shut down fully at night and rebooted fresh each morning, if I'm on my machine and check the settings and see an update is scheduled I'll always tap to restart now but usually leave my desktop to do it's own thing if I'm not using it.
The only connection problems I have at present are from my mobile network losing it.
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jaylach
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Posted: Mon Dec 12, 2016 7:41 pm |
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Resident Geekazoid Administrator |
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Joined: Wed Mar 21, 2012 5:09 am Posts: 9438 Location: The state of confusion; I just use Wyoming for mail.
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I didn't mean in any way to imply that anyone was dumb nor am/was I in any was anxious or ticked. I'm just sort of curious as to if an update just neeeds a re-start to solve an issue can really be considered faulty.
I also wanted to point out my opinion that it is a good idea to do a re-start after any updates even if Windows does not state that it is required.
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sboots
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Posted: Mon Dec 12, 2016 11:06 pm |
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Site Admin |
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Joined: Tue Apr 10, 2012 9:48 pm Posts: 2946 Location: New Jersey
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I didn't read your side of the conversation in that way at all, jay. It is unclear what the actual cause is, but it is presumed to be an update. Without the patch, apparently the random loss of connectivity requiring a reboot or IPConfig /Release /Renew can happen repeatedly and at random. I don't believe that the loss of connectivity happens moments after the update is applied. Again, details are scarce, but they report that a permanent fix is forthcoming, but the quick patch on the 9th/10th would solve the issue until the full fix is built and released. -steve
_________________ stephen boots Microsoft MVP 2004 - 2020 "Life's always an adventure with computers!"
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jaylach
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Posted: Tue Dec 13, 2016 12:06 am |
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Resident Geekazoid Administrator |
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Joined: Wed Mar 21, 2012 5:09 am Posts: 9438 Location: The state of confusion; I just use Wyoming for mail.
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Not exactly off topic but just at a bit of a tangent. Microsoft gets a LOT of flack when an update goes bad but, personally, I think they do an awesome job. Consider the number of possible configurations of a Windows system. If it is still true with Apple that there is a very limited amount of third party hardware that can be used Apple has it easy as to updates in comparission to Windows as there are a LOT less possible configurations. Just throwing out a thought...
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MacDuffie
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Posted: Tue Dec 13, 2016 10:44 am |
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Fearless Leader |
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Joined: Wed Mar 21, 2012 5:42 am Posts: 2819
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I'm a big believer in restarts myself, Jay. That's why I shut my machine down every night; not only does it clear out memory, but it reinitializes your hardware and by golly my hardware seems to like that! And yes, I agree that Microsoft does a fabulous job with all the different configurations that are out there. Really quite amazing, actually.
_________________ Patty MacDuffie Computer Haven Administrator
Live Long and Prosper Mr. Spock
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sboots
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Posted: Wed Dec 14, 2016 8:08 am |
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Site Admin |
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Joined: Tue Apr 10, 2012 9:48 pm Posts: 2946 Location: New Jersey
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Peter2150
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Posted: Sun Dec 18, 2016 12:38 am |
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welcoming committee |
Joined: Sun Apr 15, 2012 5:52 pm Posts: 970
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jaylach wrote: Not exactly off topic but just at a bit of a tangent. Microsoft gets a LOT of flack when an update goes bad but, personally, I think they do an awesome job. Consider the number of possible configurations of a Windows system. If it is still true with Apple that there is a very limited amount of third party hardware that can be used Apple has it easy as to updates in comparission to Windows as there are a LOT less possible configurations. Just throwing out a thought... Jay, I could have agreed with you wholeheartedly when I had the option to chose what I wanted to do with updates. But now that they have taken that option away and are forcing everyone to have the same updates, then by golly it's now on them to get it right for everyone. They just don't deserve slack anymore.
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jaylach
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Posted: Mon Dec 19, 2016 2:14 am |
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Resident Geekazoid Administrator |
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Joined: Wed Mar 21, 2012 5:09 am Posts: 9438 Location: The state of confusion; I just use Wyoming for mail.
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The only answer that I can give is the suggestion to set Updates to just notify. While I get updates that are listed as accumulative there are also other updates that I can or not chose to install in Windows 10. Yes the process is cumbersome but may help in certain cases.
I used the WinAero Tweaker to add Updates to my Control Panel. I used the same to set Updates to just notify. I don't have the time and energy to search out the thread but there is a thread here that shows how to hide specific updates in Windows 10.
While cumbersome it seems that the ability to pick and chose updates is still there... at least to some extent...
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bbarry
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Posted: Tue Dec 20, 2016 9:00 pm |
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welcoming committee |
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Joined: Fri Nov 30, 2012 12:47 am Posts: 2399 Location: North Central Arkansas
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jaylach
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Posted: Tue Dec 20, 2016 10:26 pm |
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Resident Geekazoid Administrator |
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Joined: Wed Mar 21, 2012 5:09 am Posts: 9438 Location: The state of confusion; I just use Wyoming for mail.
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Yep, that looks like the one.
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